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kyouyasangels_incNotes: So some of this COULD be true. Some of this I like. Some of this I don't like because as much as I lovelovelove Derek I don't think he's like, the second cumming of jesus christ minus the sandals because sandals are fucking nasty. A lot of the holding himself back part I can definitely go with. He's got that dry humor and snark deep down and I can agree that he holds it back because he doesn't want to get too familiar with others, attached, trusting, that sort of shit. So far I could see him being an...okay guy, and he does these things and I see them happening to fall into this category of INEVITABLY MAKING THE HARD DECISIONS FOR THE RIGHT THING! He's still a giant dick. But the look on his face when he clawed the fuck out of Jackson there once he turned human really said something. He took no pleasure out of 'killing' a pain in the ass sixteen year old. His uncle did. Derek even looked remorseful, resigned.
I didn't write this, some other freak did, blah blah.
"on Derek and what makes him tick (and perfect with Stiles)
Interesting thought… I just re-watched Teen Wolf this morning for the third time, and something finally dawned on to me that I totally missed in the initial viewing last night. Namely, I finally realized EXACTLY why Derek slashed Peter’s throat last year instead of letting Scott do so like he wanted to. He knew about the Alpha pack. KNEW they are coming. And in light of that fact his decision to take on the role of Alpha was an act of ultimate self sacrifice…
Because he knows about this pack, and is more than a little afraid of it. He knows that they are going to want to either recruit him, or more likely, try and kill him in order to take his power from him.
His decision to kill Peter and take the Alpha role has always been about protecting SCOTT from that.
This has never been about keeping ANYONE subjugate or gaining personal power for himself. (Though it has been about trying to build some sort of web of protection not just for himself but for all of them.) Its been about taking on the burden of leadership and all the inherent risk so Scott doesn’t have to. Because Scott didn’t CHOOSE his path. Scott was the one non-volunteer in all of this.
Derek KNEW, knew EXACTLY how risky being the Alpha of this pack was going to be, and he slashed Peter’s throat so the trouble to come would fall not ultimately on Scott’s back, but on HIS.
“Maybe I’m trying to protect you.” THE TRUTH.
He took a role he more than likely DIDN’T want, not because it was easy, but because it was right. And now he’s virtually alone to reap the consequences
I just read this (x) incredibly interesting analysis of Derek’s motivations by the amazing 4persephone (qoted above) and just wanted to add to this regarding Derek’s recruitment of Isaac, Erica and Boyd. If this analysis of Derek’s motivations is correct (and something tells me it is), the meta suggesting that Derek purposefully drove away his betas becomes that much more heart-breaking.
Because no matter why he chose to turn the three kids, what is an irrefutable truth is that though lycanthropy may be seen as a curse, what Derek gave the three was an opportunity. Where Erica once was crippled by her epilepsy and Isaac by his father’s abuse (still unclear about Boyd, though it’s been suggested he’s quite poor?), when Derek gave them the bite he gave them the power to overcome their circumstances and the opportunity to live life as they’ve always wanted. He only ever taught them survival, and when Erica and Boyd expressed their desire to leave - taking control of their own lives, making their own decisions, he never even made the attempt to keep them with him. He knows that he is the one who painted Erica and Boyd as targets, and he lets them escape.
And the thing is, we know that if he wanted, he can stop them. We’ve seen him intimidate a feral Issac-wolf and we’ve all seen how strong the alpha-beta bond is in terms of inducing loyalty in your wolves (which is why Gerard was forced to kidnap Stiles in order to root out Derek’s location). While one could argue that the reason Derek let Erica and Boyd leave in the first place was because he knew they couldn’t betray him, it makes little sense for Derek to let most of his betas go in the first place. He is about to fight the Kanima, a monster that he AND Erica together could not take down, and he knows that strength comes from belonging in a pack. In danger from both the Kanima and the Argents and perfectly aware that Scott has betrayed him to Gerard, he knowingly lets Erica and Boyd go. He knows he’s losing, so when his betas ask to leave he doesn’t even try to stop them.
…and he knows that he might very well die because of this.
That even if he survives, the alpha pack is still coming for him.
So why does he do this? Why is he so desperate to protect everyone and most of all why DOESN’T HE SAY ANYTHING?
Here is where this analysis is going to go into conjecture territory. This is purely a theory as to what makes the Alpha-wolf tick. Derek communicates so little with anyone it’s impossible to truly and accurately gauge his mental processes. So here I’m going to try my best based on both personal views and what we’ve learnt about him in the series. I’m afraid I am no psychology major nor English/film studies major, and also have not read On Fire (and I’m not entirely sure if it is considered canon by the show-runners), so please forgive me for my shoddy writing and feel free to let me know your opinions on any of these assumptions. Be warned for the absurd length (2000+ words) of this analysis.
So, moving on. First, Derek’s serious communication issues.
http://scaredywolf.tumblr.com/post/29143708104 (x)
It’s been expressly stated in the series by Derek himself that he does not trust anyone. If one had to guess at the reason for this it is more than likely that his issues stem from none other than Kate Argent. The beautiful girl whom he fell in love with, and whom betrayed his trust and murdered his entire family.
It’s no secret that the information Derek gave Kate - information that would allow one to find (and kill) his entire pack was not something that a person would share willingly with anyone. Derek was in love with Kate and he trusted her enough her to give that secret away. Yet that trust was also the biggest mistake of his life.
On some subconscious level, Derek equates trusting others - to giving away important information - with pain and betrayal and complete and utter destruction. Over the events of season 1 (and 2) Scott had been one of the only people who had begun to prove themselves as not only an ally, but potentially worthy of trust. However whatever positive progress that may have been made was shattered completely during the events of 2x10. I don’t think his complete inability to trust is a conscious decision, but it is instead an instinct that he can’t and doesn’t really want to turn off. He does not give information freely because the act is what destroyed his family and subconsciously he is possibly terrified what else it can do.
Furthermore, it is more than likely that due to his family’s death when he was young, he doesn’t know nearly as much as he should (which is also why Peter’s emergence is actually a fantastic thing for him), and some part tells me that the Argents wouldn’t be the only large family to withhold certain information from their children to protect them. This and his inability to trust others and share information puts him at a double, triple disadvantage in terms of earning the trust of others. The people he needs on his side (Scott and Stiles) knows that he withholds information - a fact which has been proven multiple times, and often automatically assumes that he knows far more than he lets on.
Peter tells Derek not to underestimate the power of ‘human love’, and this was a statement I found, knowing Derek’s wonderful experiences with ‘human love’, to be incredibly cruel. (It’s unclear whether Peter knows about Derek’s role in the Hale fire, because seeing what he’s done to Kate I have serious doubts as to whether Derek would be forgiven). This is in part why I think he had been so eager to just kill Jackson and not even give Lydia a chance to bring him back from the edge. Love between a human and a werewolf will never work, it did not with Allison (who at this point had already turned against Scott), it did not work with him (oh boy), and it’s not going to work out with Lydia. So Derek is going for the kill, he is not going to endanger Lydia unnecessarily and he is just going to end things once and for all.
http://derekwerepuppyhale.tumblr.com/post/28911666004/in-which-derek-is-telling-himself-these-things-and (x)
So all in all, Kate Argent? She REALLY screwed Derek up, as a result of her actions not only can he no longer trust anyone new in his life, he is also irrationally resistant to the act of giving away information and also missing what might be essential werewolf knowledge. Derek rejects the idea of human love. In keeping friends and sustaining allegiances, he is set up for failure.
And here I am going to throw in Stiles, because here is where one of the lovely parallels/contrasts between the two really emerge (and part of what makes me ship them so much). There’s been many brilliant meta pieces which have come to the conclusion that Stiles is also similarly broken. Where Derek uses silence as his defence mechanism, Stiles talks. It’s something you can see whenever topics comes up that he does not want to discuss, he deflects and comforts and does whatever he can to avoid actively discussing the important issue. Where there is confrontation, while Derek will always tell the truth, Stiles lies. When it comes to persuasion, Derek uses brute force and threats while Stiles uses guile and conversation. Where Derek is desperate not to communicate Stiles is desperate FOR communication, for someone to talk to and to listen to him and who will actually take him seriously. In this they complement each other perfectly.
And also, they’ve both lost important people, people whose deaths they blame themselves for, and as a result, are both desperate to protect others.
Getting back on topic, the next thing I want to speculate on is why Derek tries so hard to help and protect other people. Is he secretly a big softie and an incredibly caring person? Not unlikely.
But I think what truly motivates Derek, is his guilt, his guilt over what happened and his desire to be the cause of anyone dying again.
Here’s the thing. The cause of every trouble in the Teen Wolf universe is something that can be traced back to the Hale house fire. Derek is likely more than aware of this fact and feelspartlyresponsible for every good and bad thing that happens as a result. His sister Laura? Killed by the murdering Alpha. The murdering Alpha who bites Scott and Lydia? His uncle, driven mad by the fire (that he caused). The feral kanima murdering what seems to be innocents in Beacon Hills? Very likely Jackson who is sprouting black blood as a result of being bitten by - you guessed it, Derek. Death of Allison’s mother that leads to her breakdown? Derek’s bite, yet again. (No one (at least Allison and very possibly Scott) actually knows the real circumstances, and blame has been directly placed on him.) Potential third-season baddie Gerard? Guess who screwed up and ended up biting him?
http://fuckyeahstilesderek.tumblr.com/post/27950873205/whats-your-anchor (x)
What’s interesting is that Derek’s anchor is anger, and it’s something I’ve always been curious about. If you look at Derek’s situation, it doesn’t really seem rational for him to be angry at anyone he knows because no one had done anything to betray him, or done anything he did not already expect. You could say he’s just angry at the world in general, at his situation and at his troubles, but more than anything, he’s probably just angry at himself - and he has a lot to be angry about.
After having everyone close to him die or be killed because of his actions when he was a teenager, I can’t imagine how it would feel for Derek to (once again) be ‘the cause’ of so much death and misery. We know very well that Derek had ‘always been running’ from what happened six years ago, that he never dealt with his guilt over his family’s death and that he more than likely feels tremendous guilt every single day. No matter how good his intentions had been and how much the circumstances forced him into these situations, because of his past I don’t know if he would be able to realise that he is not the one at fault, that just because things turned out badly doesn’t mean he deserves to be blamed.
http://innerflame.tumblr.com/post/28400220046 (x)
And I think this is why he drives everyone away, why he still lives in the burnt out Hale house and prowling the forests where he grew up as a child. He is still punishing himself for six years ago and staying in his childhood home, a place which must be full of memories and ghosts is him showing to the world that he still hasn’t let go. Laura dragged him away from Beacon Hills probably precisely to prevent this from happening, to help him move on. But Laura is lured back and so is Derek and he loses the only person he could unconditionally trust, his only link to both being forgiven and forgiving himself. Now Derek drives away those closest to him so he doesn’t get them killed (again).
So in conclusion? I want to throw in this quote by Jeff Davis on season 2’s conclusion.
…because of this mistrust and his own failure with his past and because of his own failure with Scott, he starts to listen to Peter. All these moments are planned in his character arc. We’re telling something of a downfall story for Derek. We’ll see if he can redeem himself by the end of the season. (x)
As much as this season has been one of gradual breakdown for Stiles, I think more than anything it’s also been one for Derek. But unlike Stiles’ breakdown, the one for Derek has been happening off-screen, something subtle that has been almost completely lost in the chaos of the second season. I can’t help but be incredibly curious as to what Jeff Davis is referring to by ‘redemption’, which inherently suggests that Derek has done something terribly wrong (though granted, he’s made plenty of bad decisions). It is possible that Jeff Davis refers not to Derek ‘redeeming’ himself not just in the eyes of others, but also in his own eyes. For Derek to truly develop as a character, he needs to change to forgive himself and learn to trust other people. And, once again like Stiles, at the end of season 3, he might just be at his breaking point.
And this just makes me that much more excited for season 3.
Which is a year away.
Let’s not think about that."
I didn't write this, some other freak did, blah blah.
"on Derek and what makes him tick (and perfect with Stiles)
Interesting thought… I just re-watched Teen Wolf this morning for the third time, and something finally dawned on to me that I totally missed in the initial viewing last night. Namely, I finally realized EXACTLY why Derek slashed Peter’s throat last year instead of letting Scott do so like he wanted to. He knew about the Alpha pack. KNEW they are coming. And in light of that fact his decision to take on the role of Alpha was an act of ultimate self sacrifice…
Because he knows about this pack, and is more than a little afraid of it. He knows that they are going to want to either recruit him, or more likely, try and kill him in order to take his power from him.
His decision to kill Peter and take the Alpha role has always been about protecting SCOTT from that.
This has never been about keeping ANYONE subjugate or gaining personal power for himself. (Though it has been about trying to build some sort of web of protection not just for himself but for all of them.) Its been about taking on the burden of leadership and all the inherent risk so Scott doesn’t have to. Because Scott didn’t CHOOSE his path. Scott was the one non-volunteer in all of this.
Derek KNEW, knew EXACTLY how risky being the Alpha of this pack was going to be, and he slashed Peter’s throat so the trouble to come would fall not ultimately on Scott’s back, but on HIS.
“Maybe I’m trying to protect you.” THE TRUTH.
He took a role he more than likely DIDN’T want, not because it was easy, but because it was right. And now he’s virtually alone to reap the consequences
I just read this (x) incredibly interesting analysis of Derek’s motivations by the amazing 4persephone (qoted above) and just wanted to add to this regarding Derek’s recruitment of Isaac, Erica and Boyd. If this analysis of Derek’s motivations is correct (and something tells me it is), the meta suggesting that Derek purposefully drove away his betas becomes that much more heart-breaking.
Because no matter why he chose to turn the three kids, what is an irrefutable truth is that though lycanthropy may be seen as a curse, what Derek gave the three was an opportunity. Where Erica once was crippled by her epilepsy and Isaac by his father’s abuse (still unclear about Boyd, though it’s been suggested he’s quite poor?), when Derek gave them the bite he gave them the power to overcome their circumstances and the opportunity to live life as they’ve always wanted. He only ever taught them survival, and when Erica and Boyd expressed their desire to leave - taking control of their own lives, making their own decisions, he never even made the attempt to keep them with him. He knows that he is the one who painted Erica and Boyd as targets, and he lets them escape.
And the thing is, we know that if he wanted, he can stop them. We’ve seen him intimidate a feral Issac-wolf and we’ve all seen how strong the alpha-beta bond is in terms of inducing loyalty in your wolves (which is why Gerard was forced to kidnap Stiles in order to root out Derek’s location). While one could argue that the reason Derek let Erica and Boyd leave in the first place was because he knew they couldn’t betray him, it makes little sense for Derek to let most of his betas go in the first place. He is about to fight the Kanima, a monster that he AND Erica together could not take down, and he knows that strength comes from belonging in a pack. In danger from both the Kanima and the Argents and perfectly aware that Scott has betrayed him to Gerard, he knowingly lets Erica and Boyd go. He knows he’s losing, so when his betas ask to leave he doesn’t even try to stop them.
…and he knows that he might very well die because of this.
That even if he survives, the alpha pack is still coming for him.
So why does he do this? Why is he so desperate to protect everyone and most of all why DOESN’T HE SAY ANYTHING?
Here is where this analysis is going to go into conjecture territory. This is purely a theory as to what makes the Alpha-wolf tick. Derek communicates so little with anyone it’s impossible to truly and accurately gauge his mental processes. So here I’m going to try my best based on both personal views and what we’ve learnt about him in the series. I’m afraid I am no psychology major nor English/film studies major, and also have not read On Fire (and I’m not entirely sure if it is considered canon by the show-runners), so please forgive me for my shoddy writing and feel free to let me know your opinions on any of these assumptions. Be warned for the absurd length (2000+ words) of this analysis.
So, moving on. First, Derek’s serious communication issues.
http://scaredywolf.tumblr.com/post/29143708104 (x)
It’s been expressly stated in the series by Derek himself that he does not trust anyone. If one had to guess at the reason for this it is more than likely that his issues stem from none other than Kate Argent. The beautiful girl whom he fell in love with, and whom betrayed his trust and murdered his entire family.
It’s no secret that the information Derek gave Kate - information that would allow one to find (and kill) his entire pack was not something that a person would share willingly with anyone. Derek was in love with Kate and he trusted her enough her to give that secret away. Yet that trust was also the biggest mistake of his life.
On some subconscious level, Derek equates trusting others - to giving away important information - with pain and betrayal and complete and utter destruction. Over the events of season 1 (and 2) Scott had been one of the only people who had begun to prove themselves as not only an ally, but potentially worthy of trust. However whatever positive progress that may have been made was shattered completely during the events of 2x10. I don’t think his complete inability to trust is a conscious decision, but it is instead an instinct that he can’t and doesn’t really want to turn off. He does not give information freely because the act is what destroyed his family and subconsciously he is possibly terrified what else it can do.
Furthermore, it is more than likely that due to his family’s death when he was young, he doesn’t know nearly as much as he should (which is also why Peter’s emergence is actually a fantastic thing for him), and some part tells me that the Argents wouldn’t be the only large family to withhold certain information from their children to protect them. This and his inability to trust others and share information puts him at a double, triple disadvantage in terms of earning the trust of others. The people he needs on his side (Scott and Stiles) knows that he withholds information - a fact which has been proven multiple times, and often automatically assumes that he knows far more than he lets on.
Peter tells Derek not to underestimate the power of ‘human love’, and this was a statement I found, knowing Derek’s wonderful experiences with ‘human love’, to be incredibly cruel. (It’s unclear whether Peter knows about Derek’s role in the Hale fire, because seeing what he’s done to Kate I have serious doubts as to whether Derek would be forgiven). This is in part why I think he had been so eager to just kill Jackson and not even give Lydia a chance to bring him back from the edge. Love between a human and a werewolf will never work, it did not with Allison (who at this point had already turned against Scott), it did not work with him (oh boy), and it’s not going to work out with Lydia. So Derek is going for the kill, he is not going to endanger Lydia unnecessarily and he is just going to end things once and for all.
http://derekwerepuppyhale.tumblr.com/post/28911666004/in-which-derek-is-telling-himself-these-things-and (x)
So all in all, Kate Argent? She REALLY screwed Derek up, as a result of her actions not only can he no longer trust anyone new in his life, he is also irrationally resistant to the act of giving away information and also missing what might be essential werewolf knowledge. Derek rejects the idea of human love. In keeping friends and sustaining allegiances, he is set up for failure.
And here I am going to throw in Stiles, because here is where one of the lovely parallels/contrasts between the two really emerge (and part of what makes me ship them so much). There’s been many brilliant meta pieces which have come to the conclusion that Stiles is also similarly broken. Where Derek uses silence as his defence mechanism, Stiles talks. It’s something you can see whenever topics comes up that he does not want to discuss, he deflects and comforts and does whatever he can to avoid actively discussing the important issue. Where there is confrontation, while Derek will always tell the truth, Stiles lies. When it comes to persuasion, Derek uses brute force and threats while Stiles uses guile and conversation. Where Derek is desperate not to communicate Stiles is desperate FOR communication, for someone to talk to and to listen to him and who will actually take him seriously. In this they complement each other perfectly.
And also, they’ve both lost important people, people whose deaths they blame themselves for, and as a result, are both desperate to protect others.
Getting back on topic, the next thing I want to speculate on is why Derek tries so hard to help and protect other people. Is he secretly a big softie and an incredibly caring person? Not unlikely.
But I think what truly motivates Derek, is his guilt, his guilt over what happened and his desire to be the cause of anyone dying again.
Here’s the thing. The cause of every trouble in the Teen Wolf universe is something that can be traced back to the Hale house fire. Derek is likely more than aware of this fact and feelspartlyresponsible for every good and bad thing that happens as a result. His sister Laura? Killed by the murdering Alpha. The murdering Alpha who bites Scott and Lydia? His uncle, driven mad by the fire (that he caused). The feral kanima murdering what seems to be innocents in Beacon Hills? Very likely Jackson who is sprouting black blood as a result of being bitten by - you guessed it, Derek. Death of Allison’s mother that leads to her breakdown? Derek’s bite, yet again. (No one (at least Allison and very possibly Scott) actually knows the real circumstances, and blame has been directly placed on him.) Potential third-season baddie Gerard? Guess who screwed up and ended up biting him?
http://fuckyeahstilesderek.tumblr.com/post/27950873205/whats-your-anchor (x)
What’s interesting is that Derek’s anchor is anger, and it’s something I’ve always been curious about. If you look at Derek’s situation, it doesn’t really seem rational for him to be angry at anyone he knows because no one had done anything to betray him, or done anything he did not already expect. You could say he’s just angry at the world in general, at his situation and at his troubles, but more than anything, he’s probably just angry at himself - and he has a lot to be angry about.
After having everyone close to him die or be killed because of his actions when he was a teenager, I can’t imagine how it would feel for Derek to (once again) be ‘the cause’ of so much death and misery. We know very well that Derek had ‘always been running’ from what happened six years ago, that he never dealt with his guilt over his family’s death and that he more than likely feels tremendous guilt every single day. No matter how good his intentions had been and how much the circumstances forced him into these situations, because of his past I don’t know if he would be able to realise that he is not the one at fault, that just because things turned out badly doesn’t mean he deserves to be blamed.
http://innerflame.tumblr.com/post/28400220046 (x)
And I think this is why he drives everyone away, why he still lives in the burnt out Hale house and prowling the forests where he grew up as a child. He is still punishing himself for six years ago and staying in his childhood home, a place which must be full of memories and ghosts is him showing to the world that he still hasn’t let go. Laura dragged him away from Beacon Hills probably precisely to prevent this from happening, to help him move on. But Laura is lured back and so is Derek and he loses the only person he could unconditionally trust, his only link to both being forgiven and forgiving himself. Now Derek drives away those closest to him so he doesn’t get them killed (again).
So in conclusion? I want to throw in this quote by Jeff Davis on season 2’s conclusion.
…because of this mistrust and his own failure with his past and because of his own failure with Scott, he starts to listen to Peter. All these moments are planned in his character arc. We’re telling something of a downfall story for Derek. We’ll see if he can redeem himself by the end of the season. (x)
As much as this season has been one of gradual breakdown for Stiles, I think more than anything it’s also been one for Derek. But unlike Stiles’ breakdown, the one for Derek has been happening off-screen, something subtle that has been almost completely lost in the chaos of the second season. I can’t help but be incredibly curious as to what Jeff Davis is referring to by ‘redemption’, which inherently suggests that Derek has done something terribly wrong (though granted, he’s made plenty of bad decisions). It is possible that Jeff Davis refers not to Derek ‘redeeming’ himself not just in the eyes of others, but also in his own eyes. For Derek to truly develop as a character, he needs to change to forgive himself and learn to trust other people. And, once again like Stiles, at the end of season 3, he might just be at his breaking point.
And this just makes me that much more excited for season 3.
Which is a year away.
Let’s not think about that."